This exchange among Sanders, O’Malley, & Clinton highlights Hillary’s Wall Street vulnerability
This exchange is probative. A few months ago I wrote the piece, “Can Hillary Clinton win with all the old and new baggage” that raised the ire of many. This exchange provides some context to her vulnerability especially if she runs against self-funded Donald Trump.
Transcript of exchange
Lester Holt: Senator Sanders, you released a tough new ad last week in which without mentioning Secretary Clinton by name, you talk about two Democratic visions for regulating Wall Street. “One says it’s OK to take millions from big banks and tell them what to do. My plan, break up the big banks, close the tax loopholes and make them pay their fair share.” What do you see as the difference between what you would do about the banks and what Secretary Clinton would do?
Bernie Sanders: Well, the first difference is I don’t take money from big banks. I don’t get personal speaking fees from Goldman Sachs. What I would do… What I would do is understand that when you have three out of the four largest banks today, bigger than they were when we bailed them out because they were too big to fail, when you have the six largest financial institutions having assets of 60 percent of the GDP of America, it is very clear to me what you have to do. You’ve got to bring back the 21st century Glass-Steagall legislation and you’ve got to break up these huge financial institutions. They have too much economic power and they have too much financial power over our entire economy. If Teddy Roosevelt were alive today, the old Republican trust buster, what he would say is these guys are too powerful. Break them up. I believe that’s what the American people to want see. That’s my view.
Lester Holt: Secretary Clinton, help the voter understand the daylight between the two of you here.
Hillary Clinton: Well, there’s no daylight on the basic premise that there should be no bank too big to fail and no individual too powerful to jail. We agree on that. But where we disagree is the comments that Senator Sanders has made that don’t just affect me, I can take that, but he’s criticized President Obama for taking donations from Wall Street, and President Obama has led our country out of the great recession. Senator Sanders called him weak, disappointing. He even, in 2011, publicly sought someone to run in a primary against President Obama. Now, I personally believe that President Obama’s work to push through the Dodd- Frank… The Dodd-Frank bill and then to sign it was one of the most important regulatory schemes we’ve had since the 1930s. So I’m going to defend Dodd- Frank and I’m going to defend President Obama for taking on Wall Street, taking on the financial industry and getting results.
Bernie Sanders: OK. First of all…
Lester Holt: Senator Sanders, your response.
Bernie Sanders: Set the record right. In 2006 when I ran for the Senate, Senator Barack Obama was kind enough to campaign for me, 2008, I did my best to see that he was elected and in 2012, I worked as hard as I could to see that he was reelected. He and I are friends. We’ve worked together on many issues. We have some differences of opinion. But here is the issue, Secretary touched on it, can you really reform Wall Street when they are spending millions and millions of dollars on campaign contributions and when they are providing speaker fees to individuals? So it’s easy to say, well, I’m going to do this and do that, but I have doubts when people receive huge amounts of money from Wall Street.
Bernie Sanders: I am very proud, I do not have a super PAC. I do not want Wall Street’s money. I’ll rely on the middle class and working families…
Lester Holt: That’s time.
Bernie Sanders: … campaign contributions.
Lester Holt: I have a question for you…
Hillary Clinton: You know, I think since — since Senator Standers followed up on this…
Lester Holt: Thirty-second response.
Hillary Clinton: Your profusion of comments about your feelings towards President Obama are a little strange given what you said about him in 2011. But look, I have a plan that most commentators have said is tougher, more effective, and more comprehensive.
Martin O’Malley: That’s not true.
Hillary Clinton: It builds on the Dodd-Frank — yes, it is. It builds on the Dodd-Frank, regulatory scheme…
Martin O’Malley: It’s just not true.
Hillary Clinton: … but it goes much further, because…
Martin O’Malley: Oh, come on.
Hillary Clinton: … both the governor and the senator have focused only on the big banks. Lehman Brothers, AIG, the shadow banking sector were as big a problem in what caused the Great Recession, I go after them. And I can tell you that the hedge fund billionaires who are running ads against me right now, and Karl Rove, who started running an ad against me right now, funded by money from the financial services sector, sure thing, I’m the one they don’t want to be up against.
Lester Holt: Governor O’Malley.
Martin O’Malley: Yes, thank you. Yes, Lester, what Secretary Clinton just said is actually not true. What — I have put forward a plan that would actually put cops back on the beat of Wall Street. I have put forward a plan that was heralded as very comprehensive and realistic. Look, if a bank robber robs a bank and all you do is slap him on the wrist, he’s just going to keep robbing banks again. The same thing is true with people in suits. Secretary Clinton, I have a tremendous amount of respect for you, but for you to say there’s no daylight on this between the three of us is also not true. I support reinstituting a modern version of Glass- Steagall that would include going after the shadow banks, requiring capital requirements that would force them to no longer put us on the hook for these sorts of things. In prior debates I’ve heard you even bring up — I mean, now you bring up President Obama here in South Carolina in defense of the fact of your cozy relationship with Wall Street. In an earlier debate, I heard you bring up even the 9/11 victims to defend it. The truth of the matter is, Secretary Clinton, you do not go as far as reining in Wall Street as I would. And the fact of the matter is, the people of America deserve to have a president that’s on their side, protecting the main street economy from excesses on Wall Street. And we’re just as vulnerable today.
Lester Holt: Secretary Clinton, 30-second response.
Hillary Clinton: Yes, well, first of all — first of all, Paul Krugman, Barney Frank, others have all endorsed my plan. Secondly, we have Dodd-Frank. It gives us the authority already to break up big banks that pose…
Martin O’Malley: And we have never used it.
Hillary Clinton: That pose a risk to the financial sector. I want to go further and add to that. And, you know, Governor, you have raised money on Wall Street. You raised a lot of money on Wall Street when you were the head of the Democratic Governor’s Association…
Martin O’Malley: Yes, but I haven’t gotten a penny this year… Hillary Clinton: And you were … so somebody please, go on to martinomalley.com… Go on to martinomalley.com, send me your checks. They’re not giving me — zero.
Hillary Clinton: Yes, well, the point is that if we’re going to be serious about this and not just try to score political points, we should know what’s in Dodd-Frank, and what’s in Dodd-Frank already gives the president the authority…
Hillary Clinton: … with his regulators to make those decisions.
Bernie Sanders: Let me give you an example of how corrupt — how corrupt this system is. Goldman Sachs recently fined $5 billion. Goldman Sachs has given this country two secretaries of treasury, one on the Republicans, one under Democrats.
Martin O’Malley: Say it.
Bernie Sanders: The leader of Goldman Sachs is a billionaire who comes to Congress and tells us we should cut Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. Secretary Clinton — and you’re not the only one, so I don’t mean to just point the finger at you, you’ve received over $600,000 in speaking fees from Goldman Sachs in one year. I find it very strange that a major financial institution that pays $5 billion in fines for breaking the law, not one of their executives is prosecuted, while kids who smoke marijuana get a jail sentence.
Lester Holt: That’s time. Andrea.
Hillary Clinton: Well, the last point on this is, Senator Sanders, you’re the only one on this stage that voted to deregulate the financial market in 2000, to take the cops off the street, to use Governor O’Malley’s phrase, to make the SEC and the Commodities Futures Trading Commission no longer able to regulate swaps and derivatives, which were one of the main cause of the collapse in ’08. So there’s plenty…
Bernie Sanders: If you want to…
Hillary Clinton: There’s plenty of problems that we all have to face together. And the final thing I would say, we’re at least having a vigorous debate about reining in Wall Street…
Lester Holt: … Senator…
Hillary Clinton: … The Republicans want to give them more power, and repeal Dodd-Frank. That’s what we need to stop…
Bernie Sanders: Anyone who wants to check my record in taking on Wall Street, in fighting against the deregulation of Wall Street when Wall Street put billions of dollars in lobbying, in campaign contributions to get the government off their backs. They got the government off their backs. Turns out that they were crooks, and they destroyed our economy. I think it’s time to put the government back on their backs.
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